Kingspan Kooltherm – R-8/in?
Recently got sent a sample and some information on a new ‘premium’ rigid foam Kingspan is trying to market in the US after making it in Europe for quite a while. A little googling and this appears to be some sort of phenolic foam, maybe. Some of the claims in the literature have me scratching my head:
-R-8/inch. Seems awfully high for rigid foam. They claim this is from an ASTM C 518 test but the rep wouldn’t send me the actual report.
-Higher R-Value per inch in thicker panels. They claim a 1.575in panel is R-12 (7.62/in) and a 2.362in panel is R-19 (8.04/in). Is that even possible in a closed cell foam?
-Different facers change the R-value. At first I thought this was the usual radiant foil silliness, but when I pressed for details the rep said the glass/glass facer was best by about 3%, and again wouldn’t send me the report. I am assuming this is due to the fiberglass facer being slightly thicker than the foil, and 3% is in ‘who cares’ territory anyway. Not sure why they’re marketing on that though.
The sample kind of reminds me of the foam they stick flowers in – stiff, makes a crackling sound when you press your finger into it.
Anybody have any experience with this yet? Price?
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I'm not sure why the thumbnail shows a floorplan... image is correct when clicked though.
Chris,
It's a web site glitch -- if you choose a common word as the file name for your image (something like "Capture" or "Image 1") then our web site will post a thumbnail from a previously posted image with the same name.
I've renamed your image, so it should work now.
-- Martin Holladay
Chris,
It turns out that there is a report (available online). Here is the link:
Intertek Code Compliance Research Report CCRR-1066.
I am reproducing the table showing the results of the R-value testing below.
Note that 25 mm = 0.984 inch and 75 mm = 2.95 inches.
According to the table, Intertek is reporting that the 75 mm products have R-values ranging from R-8.06 per inch to R-8.44 per inch.
-- Martin Holladay
.
Martin- Thanks.
I'm still really curious how a 3x thicker product has 3.8x the R-Value (looking at the K10)
Also, that report oddly lists that "in exterior walls, use of the insulation boards is limited to Type V construction..." Type V is the least restrictive - if it's OK to use on combustible framing, I can't think of a reason why you couldn't use it on Type I-IV.
Chris,
Like you, I have several unanswered questions. I'm looking into those questions now. I'll report back as soon as I learn something.
-- Martin Holladay
If you need another bug to add to the list the replies go from 2 to 4.
Alan,
Not a bug. After I posted my Comment #4, I deleted my Comment #3, which was based on incomplete information.
-- Martin Holladay
I guess your software does not have dynamic numbering?
Alan,
It's better if the numbering isn't dynamic. That way, I can refer to "Comment #16" without worrying that a future deletion will change the comment to #15.
-- Martin Holladay
Indeed
While you are at it Martin, check out the claims for the OPTIM-R product:
Kingspan OPTIM-R is an optimum performance next generation insulation product. It is a rigid vacuum insulation panel comprising a microporous core, which is evacuated, encased and sealed in a thin, gas-tight envelope to give outstanding R-values, and an ultra-thin insulation solution.
With an R-value as high as R-56.782 for a 2″ panel thickness, Kingspan OPTIM-R provides an insulating performance that is up to 5 x better than other commonly available building insulation materials. The high level of thermal efficiency with minimal thickness, achieved by Kingspan OPTIM-R, can provide solutions for applications where a lack of construction depth or space is an issue.
https://www.trustgreenguard.com/roofing/optim-r/
Well it's a vacuum panel, so that makes sense. Vacuum panels work, but they're just really fragile and lose all their insulating power if broken.
Nick and Nate,
I'm pretty sure that Chris B's original question wasn't referring to a vacuum insulated panel (V.I.P.). Although Kingspan may make VIPs, the products that I looked up aren't VIPs. Here is the description in the lab report for the products whose R-values are listed in the table I posted:
"Kooltherm® K15, K8, K7, and K12 Insulation Boards are phenolic foam core insulation boards with composite foil facers on both surfaces. Kooltherm® K10 Insulation Boards are phenolic foam core insulation boards with a glass fiber tissue-based facing on the back surface and a composite foil facer on the exterior surface. Kooltherm® K20, K5, and K3 Insulation Boards are phenolic foam core insulation boards with a glass fiber tissue-based facing on both surfaces. The Kooltherm® insulation boards are supplied in thicknesses ranging from 25mm to 75mm, except for Kooltherm® K10 which is supplied to a maximum thickness of 120mm."
-- Martin Holladay
Even if it's real, what's the aged R value? What's the blowing agent? Some demilac products claim increased R value per inch as the foam layer gets thicker. The Heatlok HFO high lift is rated at R 7.5 per inch at 4" thick, aged value. So if this is similar and the R 8 per inch is the initial value, then it's believable....ish!
Martin, chiming in late here because of Google... Nick was referring to Kingspan's OPTIM-R product, which are VIPs. Nate was highlighting that they're VIPs.